Fighting for the faith – Chris Rosebrough – Sermon Review – Maker of Miracles by Christine Caine
Below is a transcript taken from Chris Rosebrough’s radio show podcast Fighting For The Faith Radio podcast which was originally broadcast on Monday January 6th 2014, which you can subscribe to on iTunes. I highly recommend you do this if you want to develop discernment.
You can also listen to this unbiblical sermon from Christine Caine – Maker of Miracles. This is available on YouTube > http://youtu.be/3957FwQs-0w
Here is the video link for this transcript > http://youtu.be/VNd1M71X5JI
[Segment One – 00:17:40 – 00:19:28]
Chris Rosebrough, “We will be in hour number two, we will be listening to a sermon preached yeah is that the right way of putting it – a sermon preached by Christine Caine. She is one of the Hillsong pastors who is out at large and she was at Craig Groeschel’s Life Church Dot TV not too long ago and the name of the sermon we will be reviewing from Christine Caine again word of faith heretic.
You know she is a pastor of Hillsong Church at large here in the United States and has quite a following. Because she has been promoted by well Joel Osteen, Rick Warren – you know the list goes on and on. Even recently Beth Moore you know tweeted out that she has spent some quality time with Christine Caine and even went to see Christine Caine preach at Joel Osteen’s Lakewood.
Yeah that is right and so you know of course I noted that during the Christmas break. You know that Beth Moore had said that she went to Joel Osteen’s church to hear Christine Caine preach and I noted that this tells us a lot about Beth Moore’s theology and then people tweeted back to me and said, ‘Uh who is Christine Caine and why is that bad?’
So I thought we would review another. We have done by the way this is not the first Christine Caine sermon that we have reviewed here at Fighting for the Faith. But the name of the sermon we will be reviewing is called Maker of Miracles by Christine Caine preached just like a week and a half ago at Life Church Dot TV.”
Sermon Review: Maker of Miracles by Christine Caine of Hillsong
Okay we are back hour number two of Fighting for the Faith. Sermon review time. We will be listening to a Christine Caine sermon. Christine Caine is a pastor from well Hillsong Church. She is kind of their ambassadorial pastor at large. Makes the round among the seeker driven megachurches.
The good, the bad, the ugly – we review it all here at Fighting for the Faith. We are an equal opportunities sermon reviewing service. Today’s sermon comes to us via Life Church Dot TV in Oklahoma city Oklahoma. This is where Craig Groeschel is the vision casting leader and the sermon is by Christine Caine the pastor, ambassador at large for Hillsong Church and the name of her message is Maker of Miracles and would you be surprised if I told you that she is going to twist God’s word and engage in narcissistic eisegesis and bad allegorizing of a text. You shouldn’t be. Not only is she not biblically able to be a pastor. She shouldn’t be preaching at all. She is going to twist God’s word on top of it.
Now this always causes confusion for people. The reason being is because I am going to be correcting her as if she should be preaching correctly, when she shouldn’t be preaching at all. So don’t confuse my correction as some kind of a tacit approval that she is preaching when she shouldn’t be.
So let me go ahead and kill the music and without any further or due. Here is Christine Caine and her sermon entitled Maker of Miracles. Here we go. I think she is introduced though by Craig Groeschel. Let’s do this right. Here we go.
Craig Groeschel, “Welcome today let’s introduce all of live church campuses, our network churches and those of you joining us from countries around the world. I have got to tell you – you are going to be blown away and blessed today. Because I have one of the finest guest speakers in the whole world who is going to minister to you today.
I want to tell you about Christine Caine and then you are going to get a chance to go crazy. Christine is one of our closest friends. She and Nick are very dear to both Amy and to me. We love them more than I can tell you. They are from Hillsong Church based out of Sydney, Australia. But you cannot contain Hillsong Church because they are all over the world. Christine is one of the finest evangelists I know. She is one of the greatest teachers on leadership I know. She is an amazing author. You have got to pick up her book Undaunted. If you haven’t read it you are missing out. She is the founder of A21 – a ministry that we support and we love that helps rescue people from human trafficking.
The chick can preach like nobody’s business. Would you please join me in giving her a warm Life Church Dot TV welcome. Please welcome Christine Caine.
Christine Caine, “Thank you pastor Craig. How excited I am to be here. What an honour. Thank you pastor Craig and Amy. Nick and I love you guys so much and this is home away from home you all – end time you know who I am talking to all the Life Churches, all our Network Churches, all the churches and people watching this around the world – but they tell me that you all say you are all here and I from Australia where we speak the Queens English. We say awesome and I don’t know whatever location you are in. You all need to say awesome.
See that sounds very dignified. Now if you are from America you need to say it like an American say, ‘awesome’ can you just tell there is a slight difference. Now we say awesome and you say awesome and you know I just want to echo everything that pastor Craig said we are like family. I am part of Hillsong, although I don’t sing people get very disappointed. They think if a chick gets up from Hillsong she is going to start singing Shout to the LORD.
But if I sing shout to the LORD – you will all cry to the LORD. So that isn’t going to happen and we have been part of the leadership team at Hillsong Church for 25 years and so really since I was a 1 year old and it is really just continued. Nick and I have been married for 18 years. We have two beautiful daughters. Katherine, Bobbie and Sophia, Joyce and whenever I am around pastor Craig and Amy. I feel I like I need to say they are the alpha and omega. I have got the beginning and the end. We only have two – we don’t do six and so that is kind of how it works my part of the world. I am going to jump right into the text today. I am just like family. So I am just an extended part of your global teaching team.
So if you would turn with me to The Book of Mark chapter 6. I am both Greek and a woman. So I only speak three ways – hard fast and continuously so you will not fall asleep and you better listen fast. So the Bible says in v30 of Mark 6.
Mark 6 v 30-31 (NIV – New International Version)
30 The apostles gathered around Jesus and reported to him all they had done and taught. 31 Then, because so many people were coming and going that they did not even have a chance to eat,
They are obviously not from Oklahoma city, but anyway….
Mark 6 v 31-36 (NIV – New International Version)
31 He said to them, “Come with me by yourselves to a quiet place and get some rest.” 32 So they went away by themselves in a boat to a solitary place. 33 But many who saw them leaving recognized them and ran on foot from all the towns and got there ahead of them. 34 When Jesus landed and saw a large crowd, he had compassion on them, because they were like sheep without a shepherd. So he began teaching them many things.
35 By this time it was late in the day, so his disciples came to him. “This is a remote place,” they said, “and it’s already very late. 36 Send the people away so that they can go to the surrounding countryside and villages and (go to the Jerusalem food court and) buy (some komas) themselves something to eat.”
I am actually just checking if anyone is following the text with me. It is just sort of how I have a look. It is in the original Greek I did check. But you know you can do your own research and so it says in v37….
Mark 6 v 37-42 (NIV – New International Version)
37 But he answered, “You give them something to eat.” They said to him, “That would take more than half a year’s wages! Are we to go and spend that much on bread and give it to them to eat?” 38 “How many loaves do you have?” he asked. “Go and see.” When they found out, they said, “Five—and two fish.”
39 Then Jesus directed them to have all the people sit down in groups on the green grass. 40 So they sat down in groups of hundreds and fifties. 41 Taking the five loaves and the two fish and looking up to heaven, he gave thanks and broke the loaves. Then he gave them to his disciples to distribute to the people. He also divided the two fish among them all. 42 They all ate and were satisfied, 43 and the disciples picked up twelve basketfuls of broken pieces
Everyone say broken pieces.
Mark 6 v 42-51 (NIV – New International Version)
42 They all ate and were satisfied, 43 and the disciples picked up twelve basketfuls of broken pieces of bread and fish. 44 The number of the men who had eaten was five thousand. 45 Immediately Jesus made his disciples get into the boat and go on ahead of him to Bethsaida, while he dismissed the crowd. 46 After leaving them, he went up on a mountainside to pray.
47 Later that night, the boat was in the middle of the lake, and he was alone on land. 48 He saw the disciples straining at the oars, because the wind was against them. About the fourth watch of the night Shortly before dawn he went out to them, walking on the lake. (As you would) He was about to pass by them, 49 but when they saw him walking on the lake, they thought he was a ghost. They cried out, 50 because they all saw him and were terrified. Immediately he spoke to them and said, “Take courage! It is I. Don’t be afraid.” 51 Then he climbed into the boat with them, and the wind died down.
Chris Rosebrough, “Okay now I am going to pause for a second and point out something obvious. Well at least it should be obvious. But it may not be for some. Notice she is reading through a large swath of a historical narrative. Okay now this is where you have to understand sound biblical hermeneutics. Now if you have not already heard my lectures on how to not be snookered and bamboozled and hoodwinked. You need to go to the Fighting for the Faith website and find those episodes of Fighting for the Faith on the lectures that I did a year ago on how not be snookered, deceived and bamboozled and you know by hucksters and things like that.
The reason why is because in sound biblical hermeneutics there is kind of a you know a hierarchy if you would when it comes to understanding things of this nature and what I mean by that is this – is that when you have a historical narrative you have got to be really careful about the theology that you assign to it. Now maybe the reason she is preaching through the historical narrative is because she is going to try smuggle a theology in under the guise of preaching through a historical narrative text. But the way I like to explain it is this is that if you were somebody who two thousand years ago happened to be wondering into the city of Jerusalem at the same time that Jesus was being crucified just outside the city walls and you were to have viewed and saw Jesus actually hanging on the cross between the two thieves.
What would the theology of what was happening be? And you are going, ‘well wouldn’t Jesus be dying on the cross for my sins’ and I would you know that would be a safe answer. But see the thing is that let’s say that you didn’t know that and I asked you okay theologically what is happening over there? That guy in the middle he is you know he is literally about ready to expire on the cross. Theologically what does that all mean?
Now some of you know not knowing the gospel might say well that guy is being punished for his sins. He is an evildoer and he is getting his just rewards. That might be a theology attached to it and a good guess by the way that would be a great guess.
But it would be wrong. Okay without a didactic text telling us what the theology of a historical narrative is or within the narrative itself a theology clearly laid out. You have got to be very careful in how you handle a historical narrative. So that you don’t eisegete that means to read into a biblical text something that isn’t there, a theology that is not in any biblical text. So already I am on edge here. Because she is reading a historical narrative and hermeneutically I know what she is up to. But I am trying to help you see so that you can understand what she is up to. Let’s continue….”
Mark 6 v 51-52 (NIV – New International Version)
51They were completely amazed, 52 for they had not understood about the loaves; their hearts were hardened.
Here in this text we have two very familiar stories that many of us I guess if you have been in church life at all or if you haven’t have come across a story of Jesus multiplying the fish and loaves and Jesus walking on water and normally we would teach this as two separate stories. But I don’t think you can separate v30 from v52 because the story starts before the story and ends after the story as is often the case.
We start up on a mountain side and The Bible says that the disciples had been teaching all day and they came back to Jesus and they gave an account of everything they had done and taught. No one can just go and teach whatever they want to teach. They have got to come back and give an account to authority and leadership. This is what I have been teaching – is it all okay? And so they were hungry. There is nothing ever incidental in the text that tells us that the disciples had not eaten. So they were really hungry. Jesus said we need a break. We need a rest and so what we are going to do is we are going to go over to the other side and we are going to have a little break.
Now something interesting happens before Twitter, before Facebook, before Fox News, before CNN, before global satellites, before Life Church TV because you are everywhere it is a little bit like God you are just omnipresent. So before all of that something happened where a crowd got there on foot before Jesus ever got there in a boat. There was obviously something so compelling, something so magnetic, something so attractive about this man Jesus. That people would end up getting somewhere before He ever got there. They didn’t come after the fourth worship song. They were there before he ever got there, waiting to hear from Jesus. It has taught me that when Jesus is in the house. You can’t keep people away.
People don’t care how far away they are going to park away from the building. They don’t care what seat they are going to get in. They just want….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Weird so she is likening Jesus here to a Hillsong Megachurch pastor and her experience at Hillsong the Megachurch in Sydney. That is creepy….”
Christine Caine, “They just want to get there and listen to Jesus. So Jesus begins to teach. Now the disciples are already freaking out. Because they know when this guy starts talking that he doesn’t stop and they are thinking you know we have never really understood much of any of the other parables he has ever talked about so we need to tell him that the Jerusalem food courts are going to close down because we are hungry and this is what leaders often do.
When they have a problem and they are hungry they go to the lead leader and they say it is the people’s fault. The people are hungry. Nowhere in the text does it say the people are hungry. But we know that the disciples have not yet eaten. So they go and blame the people for what they really want.
Chris Rosebrough, “Isn’t it weird that she is trying to
turn this into some kind of a leadership fable thing. Weird….”
Christine Caine, “They want Jesus to be quiet so that they can go and eat and so they say the people are really hungry and so this is what Jesus does. Because every time he is getting ready to do a miracle he prepares to do a miracle he starts right here. He says, ‘Well you give them something to eat.’ And they sit there and they think like many of us.
We go to Jesus with a prayer request and we pray about something and we don’t realise that we are the answer to our own prayer. So Jesus says, ‘You do something about it.’ Now what we think he has said is why can’t you do anything about it? We obviously misheard him and we begin to give him a list of reasons of why we can’t. The disciples start saying, ‘This is going to take eight months of a man’s salary. We don’t have enough food.’ My mother didn’t pack an extra lunch for five thousand people. There is no way that we are going to be able to feed them and so they begin to give Jesus a list of why not. So often we do that. I remember when we had a sense Nick and I to start the A21 campaign. Now we were living in Australia….
Chris Rosebrough, “Now notice I mean that was just a seem less transition from the text to herself. This text has nothing to do with her and her husband and their A21 network or anything like that. Nothing whatsoever and there was a weird phrase she said just a few seconds ago about that you are the answer to your own prayer.
That is not what this text is about either. So now she is reading herself into this text. She is you know she has read it and now she is really not giving a coherent exegetical understanding of the text. So she has pulled out of the historical narrative and is talking about herself. This text has nothing to do with her or you know me or you in that sense….”
Christine Caine, “Now we were living in Australia. We had just had our second born. I was 41 years old and we already were travelling around the world and helping to build churches and we were the network pastors for the Hillsong Church and so we have a lot going on and I remember when there was this sense that ‘Christine I want you to do something about it. You do something about helping to rescue people from human trafficking….”
Chris Rosebrough, “So there was this sense. So apparently God the Holy Spirit speaks directly to her. See it is just like when Jesus asked the disciples or said you do something about the fact that there is nothing to eat. No it is not at all and why should I believe that God the Holy Spirit is speaking to Christine Caine or has spoken to Christine Caine – why? She is a pastor despite the fact that God’s word forbids her to be one.
Why would God the Holy Spirit inspire the biblical authors to make it clear that men are the ones who are to be pastors and then turn around and just ignore what he inspired the apostles to write and then turn around and then give this woman you know direct revelation and dreams and visions and stuff like that. That is not how God the Holy Spirit works. She does not obey God’s word. She does not listen to God’s word. She does not heed God’s word and claims to be receiving direct revelation from God. She is deceived and that is not how the Holy Spirit operates….”
Christine Caine, “I remember going to God. But God I can’t. But God I am a woman. But God I am 41. But God I have just had a newborn baby. But God I live in Sydney, Australia. Do you know how far that is from Europe and I could imagine God is heaven going you know I didn’t know she was a chick Gabriel. Did you know that she was a woman? Wow did anyone know Chris had a baby. Did we miss the shower? Did we miss the baby shower in heaven? I have got no idea and I am just – does anyone know where Australia is relative to Greece. Could someone bring me a GPS. Could someone Peter get me a map book.
You know God I don’t have a spare ten million dollars to run there. Well you know and God Greece is singlehandedly about to bankrupt the whole planet. You are welcome and so that is where you want us to start and I imagine God is in heaven, ‘Oh my God no I am God. I am having an accidental crisis – all three of me. I am having a crisis up here economically. What I am going to do? Did you all know that wall street was about to have a schizophrenic attack….”
Chris Rosebrough, “No I have idea what the – what you would call what it is we just heard. But it serves no true exegetical function. Okay because whose life is she exegeting? Her own and she is basically talking about her imagination and things like that. This is all part of deception. This has nothing to do with sound biblical exegeting of the biblical passage….”
Christine Caine, “I don’t know who Mr. Dale Jones is but he is down three points one day, up four points the next. I really don’t know what’s…but this is God. This is God who woke up one day – burped one earth oops look at what I did. That is God – He is still in control, whatever is happening politically, socially, morally, economically, personally. God is still on the throne. He is still sovereign.”
Chris Rosebrough, “Yeah and she is shouting all of this in conjunction with supposedly the fact that God directly told her to start some kind of a network.
Christine Caine, “He is still sovereign and He is still God. So I said, ‘But God, but God I can’t and God is kind of rolling His eyes going I never even asked you if you could or you couldn’t. It wasn’t a question. I said you give them something to eat. So then as God stops listening I love this with Jesus. He listens to them give their excuses why not and then in v38 He says….
Mark 6 v 38 (NIV – New International Version)
38 “How many loaves do you have?” he asked. “Go and see.”
It is almost like He didn’t even listen to their excuses why not? He says….
Mark 6 v 38 (NIV – New International Version)
38 “How many loaves do you have?” he asked. “Go and see.”
He sent them back into the crowd to see what they do have. Because the ingredients for a miracle are always in our midst. We always have the ingredients for a miracle. It is just that they are in seed form and we devalue the seed because it doesn’t look like the harvest and so we have nothing to work with….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Where in The Bible does it say that all of the ingredients we need for a miracle are in our midst and they are in seed form? What passage of The Bible says that? Answer not one. Especially Mark 6 – Mark 6 teaches nothing of the sort. She is inserting things into the biblical text that are not there. In a narcissistic way of course. But we continue….”
Christine Caine, “But Jesus cannot multiply what we do not recognize. So he says, ‘Go and have a look.’ (Mark 6 v 38)”
Chris Rosebrough, “Where in The Bible does it say Jesus cannot multiply what we do not recognize? What passage of scripture says that? Not one. There isn’t a single passage of scripture that says this nonsense. She is making it up and inserting it into the text.
Now let me give you by way of contrast what Dr. Paul Kretzmann Commentary. It is a popular commentary written on a lay level. What he wrote about this text and let’s just do a little comparative work as we listen the sermon. From the feeding of the five thousand from Dr. Paul Kretzmann commentary Mark 6 v 33-44 and you will notice that this is written in the King James you know this is key to the King James Bible. Here is what it says….
Kretzmanns Popular Commentary
v33 And the people saw them departing, and many knew Him, and ran afoot thither out of all the cities, and out went them, and came together unto Him (unto Jesus).
v34. And Jesus, when He came out, saw much people, and was moved with compassion toward them, because they were as sheep not having a shepherd. And He began to teach them many things. [Now here is the commentary part]
Jesus actually managed to get away in a boat alone with His disciples; but His embarking was nevertheless witnessed by some people, and His identity was all too well known in the district, probably the neighbourhood of Bethsaida. Besides, they noted and drew correct conclusions as to the course which they were taking in their boat, and the part of the country toward which they were heading.
And the news was rapidly passed along the line. While Jesus, therefore, was slowly sailing across the sea, the multitude, swelled by additional inquisitive people from the cities on the northwest shore, made the trip around the north side of the lake afoot, a distance of some ten miles. They walked very rapidly; they ran together, and came ahead of them; and they beat them to their destination.
Curiosity, for the most part; what an immense factor in the destiny of individuals and of the nations! And so it happened that when Jesus went out of the ship, He saw a great multitude gathered together awaiting Him. He did not stop to analyze the motives that might have prompted these people to come out into the uninhabited country; His Saviour’s heart felt only the deepest pity for them. They were as sheep without shepherds. In all the synagogues of Galilee there were rabbis and scribes, but the food which they supplied to their congregations was a diluted pap and treacle of the matter which the Jerusalem schools were teaching the young theologians.
Chris Rosebrough, “So Jesus he again the verse talks about the fact that they were sheep without a shepherd and so Jesus Kretzmann keys in on the fact that they are getting pap and pablum from the Pharisaical rabbis and Jesus has compassion on them. And what is he going to do? He is going to teach them….”
Kretzmanns Popular Commentary
So the people were in a state of greatest spiritual neglect. And so the great friend of sinners forgot His own weariness, His urgent need of rest, and He began a long sermon to them and He taught them many things that pertained to their salvation. So Jesus dives right in and preaches a sermon to them. Okay teaching them many things. Next okay this next section is the testing of the disciples.
The Testing of The Disciples
v35. And when the day was now far spent, His disciples came unto Him and said, This is a desert place, and now the time is far passed. v36. Send them away that they may go into the country round about and into the villages and buy themselves bread; for they have nothing to eat. v37. He answered and said unto them, Give ye them to eat. (You give them something to eat)
And they say unto Him, Shall we go and buy two hundred pennyworth of bread, and give them to eat? v38. He saith unto them, How many loaves have ye? Go and see. And when they knew, they say, Five, and two fishes. In this story, as in many others, the Holy Spirit has permitted the evangelist to record such parts of the conversation as he remembered.
The hour had advanced very far, it was late in the day, when the disciples thought it their duty to interfere and to remind the Master of the necessity of taking care of the body also. There is a certain amount of impatience contained in the address to Jesus: The place is uninhabited, and the hour is advanced. He should dismiss them; they could go to the farmhouses and the little villages situated within a radius of a few miles and buy themselves something to eat. Jesus takes the opportunity of testing their trust in His ability to help in this emergency. He urges them to take care of the unbidden guests; by skilful questioning He brings out the fact that they have been figuring the number of loaves that might be bought for two hundred denarii (between thirty-three and thirty-four dollars), that they have found the provisions on hand to amount to five loaves of bread and two fish. The concern of the disciples at the inquiry of Jesus is illuminating as showing the weakness of their faith.
Chris Rosebrough, “So what is going on here? Jesus is testing their faith – their trust in Him. This is all from a good proper exegesis of this passage. So then we get to v39. The feeding of the five thousand….”
The feeding: v39. And so He commanded them to make all sit down by companies upon the green grass. v40. And they sat down in ranks, by hundreds and by fifties. v41. And when He had taken the five loaves and the two fishes, He Looked up to heaven, and blessed, and broke the loaves, and gave them to His disciples to set before them; and the two fishes divided He among them all.
v42. And. they did. all eat and were filled. v43. And they took up twelve baskets full of the fragments, and of the fishes. v44. And they that did eat of the loaves were about five thousand men. Now nothing could be more expressive than the contrast afforded here between the helpless puttering of the disciples and the cool, majestic bearing of Christ in taking charge of the situation.
He had the disciples give orders that all should recline on the grass in orderly groups, for just at this place there was a meadow near the shore of the lake. And they sat down in groups as in garden squares, as orderly as Rowers planted in rows a fine bit of vivid description.
Then Jesus, taking the five loaves and the two fishes, and having looked up to heaven, spoke the blessing upon the food. Note: He broke the bread and passed it on for distribution; He divided the fishes and had them taken to all in a similar way; and under His hands the amount of food grew. The miracle is mentioned by all four evangelists, and was one that could not be counterfeited, a secret supply being out of the question. It is a full proof for the divinity of Christ.
All ate, and all had enough to eat. And not only that: when the fragments were gathered into the large carrying baskets used by the people of Palestine, twelve of these were filled. And the number of those that had eaten is expressly stated, it being so easy to count them as they sat in groups: five thousand men, without women and children.
Chris Rosebrough, “So there you go. Who is this text about? It is about Jesus. What does this miracle prove? The divinity of Jesus. It is a true miracle and it harkens back to the days when the children of Israel were in another wilderness place. Wondering in the wilderness on their way to the promised land and God fed them manner from heaven.
Here Jesus feeds them bread by multiplying loaves and fishes. This is a miracle that points people to the fact that Jesus is the Messiah and so Jesus in this text tests the faith of the disciples and their trust in Him and you can already see things are not good. The disciples are waffling in their faith. But Jesus calmly majestically in a godly fashion because that is who He is – takes control of the situation and performs a miracle that shows that He is the Messiah and that He is none other than God in human flesh and that is the right way of preaching a text like this.
But well let’s just put this way. Christine Caine number one shouldn’t be preaching. Number two wouldn’t know how to preach this way if her life depended on it. Because she is not about preaching about Jesus. She is really about preaching about herself. We continue….”
Christine Caine, “He sends them to the crowd to have a look because the ingredients are in there. Now they go around looking. Now the text has told us in v38 that day there were five thousand men counted. Because in that time in history that is how you counted. You counted according to the men. But theologians and historians would say if you accurately counted women and children and the other gospels record besides women and children.
If you include women and children which I love to do. I am a woman. I was a child. So if you include those they say it would not be unrealistic to say there was at least fifteen thousand people on that mountain side. So they go in and begin to look amongst fifteen thousand people and one little boy gives his five loaves, his five pieces of Ezekiel bread, his two little anchovies that is all he has. He gives it out.
Do you think in a crowd of fifteen thousand that there was only one little boy with a packed lunch? Oh I guarantee there were more packed lunches that day. But this is what happens and it happens to us in church every week and it happens to us in life and that we see the magnitude of the problem that the disciples went around the crowd and they said, ‘anyone got a lunch?’ So we have got to feed fifteen thousand people. Jesus isn’t going to stop until we feed everyone and there is a crowd of fifteen thousand. Who has got a spare lunch for fifteen thousand?
What we do is we look at the enormity and the magnitude of the problem and we think because I can’t do everything. I will do nothing. Instead of the one thing that would activate something. Jesus never asks us to do everything….”
Chris Rosebrough, “What this has nothing to do with Jesus asking you to do anything. Jesus didn’t ask you about the loaves and fishes. Jesus isn’t asking you to do anything in this passage. Except for believe that He is the Messiah and trust in Him for the forgiveness of your sins. What are you talking about?”
Christine Caine, “Every week when our pastor stands up and tells us to bring the tithe into the storehouse. He is not asking any one person to do everything….”
Chris Rosebrough, “This text isn’t about tithing. What are you talking about?
Christine Caine, “But God is commanding all of us to do the one thing that we can all do which is bring our tithe into the storehouse. When we have a need….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Yeah those Hillsong folks sure do seem to be about money don’t they as well as the megachurch pastors like Life Church Dot TV hmm weird huh?”
Christine Caine, “We are not asked to do everything. When it came to helping to rescue twenty seven million slaves God wasn’t asking us to do it all. But he said what is the one thing that you do have and if you give me that one thing I will be able to do something absolutely miraculous with it Christine. But I need the one thing. So that little boy gave it.
Now did you know notice who gave the ingredients for a miracle that I am talking about today. It is quite fascinating to me that it was the little boy that was uncounted that provided the ingredients for the miracle that counted. The text tells us that five thousand men counted that day. So a little boy who was not….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Now here is the weird part.
Let me read the text again from the ESV. Okay….
Mark 6 v 33-34 (ESV – English Standard Version)
33 Now many saw them going and recognized them, and they ran there on foot from all the towns and got there ahead of them. 34 When he went ashore he saw a great crowd,
Now pay attention who gives up their lunch? Okay
Mark 6 v 34-40 (ESV – English Standard Version)
34….and he had compassion on them, because they were like sheep without a shepherd. And he began to teach them many things.
35 And when it grew late, his disciples came to him and said, “This is a desolate place, and the hour is now late. 36 Send them away to go into the surrounding countryside and villages and buy themselves something to eat.” 37 But he answered them, “You give them something to eat.” And they said to him, “Shall we go and buy two hundred denarii worth of bread and give it to them to eat?” 38 And he said to them, “How many loaves do you have? Go and see.” And when they had found out, they said, “Five, and two fish.” 39 Then he commanded them all to sit down in groups on the green grass. 40 So they sat down in groups, by hundreds and by fifties.
Now notice here again I know that this miracle occurs in all four gospels. But she didn’t read from this text that a little boy gave up his lunch. Because this particular telling of the story of the feeding of the five thousand doesn’t say anything about a little boy does it? No it doesn’t. Okay we continue.
Christine Caine, “So a little boy who was not counted and the thing that I discovered church is that it is always the ones that everybody else discounts. It is the ones that everyone else thinks doesn’t count. It is the ones that everything else thinks your life will never amount to anything. You are not educated enough. You are not talented enough. You are not gifted enough.
You are not smart enough. You are not resourced enough. Everyone else discounts us. You are not a celebrity enough. You don’t know the right people. Jesus says, ‘I might just be able to use that person. That everybody else is discounted. The one that society thinks doesn’t count. Because I know that I will get glory from that life. Because everyone will know that they could never have done it in their life.’ God always takes the ones that everyone else discounts. You know who packed his lunch that day. I promise you if you know anything about society this time – it was not his father. His mother packed his lunch. Do you think when that woman got up that day and packed some anchovies and some Ezekiel bread she thought she was doing anything that was world changing….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Again I just find it weird that she is making a huge point here. But the text she read doesn’t say anything about a little boy.
She stuck it in there. Weird….”
Christine Caine, “Do you think when that woman got up that day and packed some anchovies and some Ezekiel bread she thought she was doing anything that was world changing yet she was packing the ingredients for a miracle in that little boys lunch that I would talking about two thousand years later. I don’t know every day when you are driving your kids to school.
You perhaps could be home schooling your kids. You could be the cool house where all the kids come over after school and you are speaking life instead of death over those young people. Often when you think what you are doing is insignificant. Your job doesn’t matter. Your life doesn’t matter. I want you to know that everything you do, everything you say, everything you think contains the ingredients of a miracle that can change generations. Don’t devalue the smallness of the seed that you have….”
Chris Rosebrough, “This text doesn’t say that at all. She is literally sticking a theology into this passage that isn’t there. She is making this passage teach something that it doesn’t teach. This is classic eisegetical Bible twisting. Sticking stuff into a biblical text that isn’t there….”
Christine Caine, “Don’t devalue the smallness of the seed that you have. Don’t ever devalue it and so we start and then what do they do? They bring it to Jesus. Now could you imagine their frustration when they brought that to Jesus. Five loaves…I could imagine especially Peter. ‘You see Jesus I told you these people are really stingy.’
We should have sent them to the mall. Because Jesus if you did what we said everyone wouldn’t be here hungry anymore. Because now Jesus it is impossible. Now Jesus all you have got is five loaves and two fish. Why didn’t you do what we said? And how often are we like that with God? We bring the small thing to him when the situation is impossible and we think the impossibility excludes God from having any ability to do anything.”
Chris Rosebrough, “What are you talking about?
This text doesn’t say any of that….”
Christine Caine, “But God does not even turn up until it is impossible. You don’t need God while it is still possible. While you are smart enough. While you are resourced enough. While you are gifted enough. While you are talented enough. Why do you need God? In fact for many of the things that we ask the LORD’s help for. The things that we say I want a miracle for. They are not miracle issues. They are management issues. Most of us say Jesus you know I need a financial miracle. No honey you just to stop spending more than you earn. Very simple that is it and then God can turn up for the financial miracle. Jesus I need a health miracle. No you just need to stop eating the krispy kremes and get on the treadmill and you know what? Now it is very quiet. So a lot of what we are asking miracles for, we are not even in the miracle zone yet. Because God says, ‘Oh no that is in the management zone. You can do that yourself. I am not even turning up until we need the miracle.’
Chris Rosebrough, “This text doesn’t teach anything about miracle zones or management zones or anything of the sort. This isn’t about some miracle that God wants to perform in your life or some task that Jesus is calling you to. It is not about that at all. This is a historical narrative that took place in a real place in time and this is about Jesus and Him feeding five thousand people miraculously and testing the faith – the shaky faith of His disciples.
This is not about some task that Jesus is calling you to at all. Or the miracle zone versus the management zone. This is nonsense….”
Christine Caine, “So impossible is where God starts. We think the impossibility of a circumstance disqualifies God from being able to do anything – when that is what makes Him God. God is not limited to our time and space continuum. God is supernatural. God turns up when everything else has been exhausted. I don’t know what your need might be today.
You might have a physical need, a financial need, an emotional need, a relational need and in the natural it seems like it is impossible. There is no way forward. I want you to know you are poised for a miracle today. That is when Jesus turns up. Impossible is where He begins….”
Chris Rosebrough, “This text doesn’t teach that. What are you talking about?”
Christine Caine, “Because what is impossible with man is possible with God. With God all things are possible and nothing is impossible with God. Nothing so He begins and do you see what he does next? They bring Him loaves and two fishes and The Bible says He gave thanks. Jesus gave thanks for what would never be enough. He began to bless what was not enough. How often do we instead of bless our not enough – curse our not enough…”
Chris Rosebrough, “Oh really so oh Jesus by way of example blessed the not enough. So that you need to bless the not enough in your life, so that then the miracle can happen in your life too. This nowhere in scripture does it promise that Jesus is going to multiply anything in your life to perform some kind of a miracle and you need to sit there and bless a not enough….”
Christine Caine, “I hate this house. I hate my boss. I hate my job. I can’t stand my marriage. My kids are just losers. It is amazing to me how when we are disillusioned or we are disappointed or we are discouraged because things haven’t worked out how we wanted them. We feel that God didn’t come through in our timing or God didn’t come through in the way we wanted Him to come through. We begin to murmur, grumble and complain and curse the very things that contain an ingredient for a miracle and God says….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Curse the things that contain an ingredient for a miracle. Where in The Bible does it say that you have the ingredients for a miracle sitting right there and you need to bless them so that a miracle can happen?”
Christine Caine, “You know what why don’t you begin to bless your not enough – instead of cursing? Do you know how your whole year would change – if you began to change your confession? Instead of going I hate this house. You could begin to just say you know what this might not be where we are ultimately going to end up living. But I thank God right now we have got a roof over our head.
This may not be the job that I want in the long term. But I thank God right now we have got some food on the table. Maybe my marriage isn’t where I want it to be. But I thank God right now that we are both working on this thing. Maybe my kids are not serving the Lord in the way that I am believing God that they will. But I thank God that the hound of heaven is chasing them down and they are going to end up back in the house of God and they are going to be serving God. How much would our lives change if we began to bless and not curse? Because we expect God to bless what we curse and Jesus began by blessing what was never going to be enough….”
Chris Rosebrough, “We expect God to bless what we curse. What are you talking about? This text has nothing to do with any of this. This is what is the phrase? Textual abuse. We are dealing with a major form of textual abuse going on here at the hands of Christine Caine….”
Christine Caine, “Jesus began by blessing what was never going to be enough, knowing that if you bring your not enough into the hands of a God who is more than enough. He will do such a miracle. He blessed it what was never going to be enough and then did you see what happened? The miracle of multiplication did not happen until He broke it. The miracle is in the breaking….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Now I am going to point something out here. It wasn’t that long ago. Probably less than two years ago that Robert Morris of the Blessed Life fame preached his Blessed Life sermon at Life Church Dot TV and his little stick that he does on this passage.
He claims that the loaves and fishes didn’t multiply until the disciples you know they Jesus gave them the food and told them to go and distribute it and they wouldn’t multiply until they had distributed almost everything that was in their baskets and as soon as their basket was empty it would fill up again. That was what he claimed which is a completely preposterous claim. But I say this just because to remind the folks at Life Church Dot TV about what Robert Morris did with this text and note the fact that Christine Caine is saying the exact opposite thing that Robert Morris said. That is absolutely fascinating….”
Christine Caine, “While Jesus kept breaking. The miracle kept multiplying. I don’t know if there is anyone else in the room besides me that knows what it is to be broken. I don’t know if anyone has ever had a broken heart. If anyone has ever come from a broken family. If anyone has ever had a broken body. If anyone has ever had broken finances. If anyone has had a broken relationships or a broken life and so often we think that brokenness disqualifies us from the purposes of God….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Yeah everybody does. Everybody experiences those things because that is well the fruit of our sin. This is what we face in this broken world because we are under a curse. Because we are born dead in trespasses in sins and at war with God. This is what happens to us all of us and yet she says, ‘I don’t know if this has ever happened to you.’ And you sit there, ‘Oh it has happened to me. Oh she is preaching…’ This is just a trick. Some kind of weird manipulation that is going on here.”
Christine Caine, “…..So often we think that brokenness disqualifies us from the purposes of God and from what it is that God wants us to do with our lives. We think well God can’t use me. I was abused…or God can’t use me…because I am divorced….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Now I am going to back this up a little bit. The reason why is because oh not only is this manipulation, it is interesting manipulation. Because here is the question I have for you. What is it with evangelicalism and their emphasis on being quote used unquote by God? Okay because it is the weirdest thing. I don’t quite get it.
You know the my only….I have to kind of speculate here….is that you this somehow quote being used by God unquote is some kind of subjective proof that they are okay with God. That somehow everything is alright. That you know God and them are okay and if God is not using you then oh no something is terribly wrong. There is sin in your life or something and maybe you are not even saved. That is what I am suspecting is going on here.
But that is not where I want to put the emphasis as I analyse this segment. I want to point something out here. Whether or not quote God uses you okay in a way that can somehow can give you affirmation that you are saved. The question is this is that since all of us not. There is not a single one of us is not qualified to be used by God. Not me, not you, not Christine Caine, not even the Pope.
Okay there is nobody who isn’t a sinner. We all be sinners big time and if God gave all of us what we deserve, we would all be in hell right now. Because every single one of us – all six point five or seven billion of us on this planet are all born dead in trespasses and sins and at war with God and if God gave us all what we deserve well would not only would God not use us.
He would just punish us all to death. So what on earth could we possibly do to make it so that God would quote use us? Answer there is nothing we could do. Okay so how does one go from being dead in trespasses in sins to being an instrument of God for the preaching of the gospel, for teaching the faith, the building up of the body of Christ for caring for others.
Okay because I am absolutely convinced that God does use people. But the emphasis on the using here is the weird thing to me. Okay God uses people. God has used people in my life. God used other people in your life. Okay you get what I am saying. So how do you go from dead in trespasses in sins and under the wrath of God to being in the grace of God?
The answer is this penitent faith and trust in Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. The law must be preached to sinners to strip them of their self-righteousness and show them that they stand condemned before God and then the gospel must be preached. The sweet good news that Christ has died for our sins.
The sweet good news that He can forgive somebody even as sinful as me – as sinful as you and that His death on the cross has propitiated the wrath of God in totality and is sufficient for our salvation. Right so penitent faith and trust in Christ it is God’s working in us to bring us to penitent faith in Him. By which He then humbles us, washes us, forgives us, sanctifies us, and makes us into instruments to be used for His purposes. I don’t have a problem with that.
But notice here how she talks about this and notice what is missing. She will talk about people not being worthy because they have committed this sin or that sin. Well yeah that does make somebody unworthy quote be used by God. But she doesn’t talk about the cross and the forgiveness of sins and repentance and faith in Christ for the forgiveness of sins or bearing fruit in keeping with that repentance and you know living out a sanctified Christian life.
She doesn’t talk about any of that. She skips over all the major doctrines and categories theologically. Repentance, faith, forgiveness, the propitiation won by Christ on the cross and the sanctifying work of the Spirit and just skips over all of that. You know kind of leapfrogged over it and you know doesn’t even mention it and gets right onto something else without mentioning the cross and you can’t do that in biblical Christianity. So I am going to back this up a little bit so you can the context. We continue….”
Christine Caine, “While Jesus kept breaking. The miracle kept multiplying. I don’t know if there is anyone else in the room besides me that knows what it is to be broken. I don’t know if anyone has ever had a broken heart. If anyone has ever come from a broken family. If anyone has ever had a broken body. If anyone has ever had broken finances. If anyone has had a broken relationships or a broken life and so often we think that brokenness disqualifies us from the purposes of God….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Our sin does….”
Christine Caine, “And from what it is that God wants to do with our lives.
Christine Caine, “…..So often we think that brokenness disqualifies us from the purposes of God and from what it is that God wants us to do with our lives. We think well God can’t use me. I was abused…or God can’t use me…because I am divorced….or God can’t use me because I committed just such great sins in my past and what we try to do through our shame and our guilt and our condemnation that the enemy heaps on us. We try to hide those broken places. We try to hide those scars. We try to hide it all and think you know what if I could just wear some sort of mask and just get through this thing called life….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Isn’t the solution to all of that forgiveness of sins through the shed blood of Christ? Why aren’t you talking about that?”
Christine Caine, “I wish God could use me. But He can’t because I am so broken. But I want to tell you today that it is from those broken places that you are qualified to be used by God. It is not from my strengths that God is using me….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Oh that is blasphemy. No it is not from those broken places that you are qualified to be used by God. That is absolutely blasphemous. It is through the broken body of Jesus Christ bleeding on the cross for your sins that you are qualified to be used of God. What she just spoke is utter blasphemy.
What I just said is the truth. She is preaching a completely cross-less, repentance-less, forgiveness-less Christianity and saying that it is because of your brokenness in your sinful condition that is what makes you worthy to be used by God. No it doesn’t. That is what makes you worthy of hell. What is she is preaching is rank heresy. We continue….”
Christine Caine, “It is not from my strengths that God is using me to make a difference in the world. It is from those broken places. It was the child that was left in a hospital unnamed and unwanted when I was born. The girl that was sexually abused for twelve years at the hands of four men. The girl that grew up in the poorest local government area in my state in Australia where I grew up.
The marginalised ethnic migrant, second generation Greek girl – so marginalised because of my ethnicity and my gender. It is that girl that God took all those broken pieces adoption and abuse and poverty and said you know what Christine, what happened to you isn’t good and the enemy tried to steal, kill and destroy your life.
But if you allow me to I will take all those broken fragments of your life and I will weave them together and I will work together for good – the things that the enemy meant for evil and God has woven them all together and God has taken an unnamed unwanted abused adopted girl and not only rescued me. But He is now using me to rescue others that are bound in sex slavery….”
Chris Rosebrough, “And what an earth does that have to do with Jesus feeding of the five thousand? Not one thing….”
Christine Caine, “It would be just like God. I feel like Joseph today. Where I stand in front of…he stood in front of his brothers and he said, ‘You know what you meant this as evil against me. But God meant it for this very purpose to save many people alive…’ and church I want to tell you the thing that you thought was going to kill you. The thing that you thought you would never recover from.
God could never use you in business again, He could never use you relationally again. That is the very thing that God wants to turn around and redeem for His glory. The enemy wants you to think it is all over. But let me tell you this. Some of you have been struggling. You have been fighting. You have had a really hard year. But I want to remind you that the devil on his best day, didn’t take you out on your worst day. You are still here. You are still fighting. There is still life. There is still a future….”
Chris Rosebrough, “What are you talking about? The devil took us all out. Literally all of us, took us all out in the garden of Eden. We were all born dead in trespasses in sins and under the power of the devil. Again this is just absolutely blasphemous. Not only should she not be preaching. Because she is a woman. She is preaching rank heresy and false doctrine and twisting God’s word….”
Christine Caine, “There is still a future while you are still breathing and God can redeem every broken piece of your past and He can help to give someone else a future through your past…..”
Chris Rosebrough, “Notice we are talking about redemption now. God can redeem every broken piece of your past. How about Christ can redeem you? You have been redeemed by the shed blood of Christ on the cross. Big difference. We continue….”
Christine Caine, “So Jesus broke it and the scripture tells us that while He broke it, He continued to multiply and then I love this part of the text. It says….
Mark 6 v 42 (NIV – New International Version)
42 And they all ate and were satisfied.
Christine Caine, “And normally we end here and then we come back next week to church and then we think, ‘awesome I was filled last week. Jesus I need you to fill me again. But in the day and hour which we live in the church it is not enough just to live miracle to miracle. It is not enough. Because it is what happens between the miracles that is really going to determine the strength of our Christian walk in the day and the age in which we live….”
Chris Rosebrough, “This is nonsense. It is not enough to live miracle to miracle to what you do between the miracles. Where are you getting any of this from God’s word? None of this is taught there. This is just gobbledygook….”
Christine Caine, “So Jesus finishes that miracle and then He says to the disciples, “I want you to go and gather twelve basketfuls which is like a sack over your shoulder of the broken pieces. There was exactly twelve basketfuls left over. It is not an accident. Twelve basketfuls – twelve disciples. So He said, “I want you to go and get a basketful each and then The Bible tells us that He immediately sent them into a storm….”
Chris Rosebrough, “I want you to go and get a basketful each? That is not what the text says. Okay let’s do this again. Hang on a second here. Mark 6. By the way the little detail about the little boy. The only gospel that appears in is in The Gospel of John. The synoptic gospels do not have that little detail. Now I want to read the end of this story so you can…she is totally mangling the end of the story.
Mark 6 v 40 (ESV – English Standard Version)
40 So they sat down in groups, by hundreds and by fifties.
So Mark 6 v 41 now….
Mark 6 v 41-42 (ESV – English Standard Version)
41 And taking the five loaves and the two fish he looked up to heaven and said a blessing and broke the loaves and gave them to the disciples to set before the people. And he divided the two fish among them all. 42 And they all ate and were satisfied.
And here is what v43 says. It doesn’t say and Jesus said, ‘Go collect twelve baskets full at all.’ That is not what it says. But that is what she says it says. But here is what the text says….
Mark 6 v 43 (ESV – English Standard Version)
43 And they took up twelve baskets full of broken pieces and of the fish. 44 And those who ate the loaves were five thousand men.
So it doesn’t say Jesus sent them out to collect twelve baskets. It just says that they happened to collect afterwards you know the leftovers and the leftovers was twelve basketfuls and I am going to back this up again. So you can hear what she is doing with this. She is literally doing violence to this text. Textual abuse….”
Christine Caine, “So Jesus finishes that miracle and then He says to the disciples, “I want you to go and gather twelve basketfuls which is like a sack over your shoulder of the broken pieces. There was exactly twelve basketfuls left over. It is not an accident. Twelve basketfuls – twelve disciples. So He said, “I want you to go and get a basketful each….”
Chris Rosebrough, “No He didn’t….”
Christine Caine, “….and then The Bible tells us that He immediately sent them into a storm. This is an omniscient God. He knew where He was sending them. Not all storms are from the devil. Sometimes God allows us to go into a storm because He wants to reveal to us what is already inside of us….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Yeah notice here they actually went into a – onto the real sea of Galilee and they experienced a real storm. Okay so now she has allegorized the storm into about you know some storm that God is sending you into in your life. Now you get what I am saying here. I mean this is just nonsense….”
Christine Caine, “We often don’t know. We think we believe one thing and it is a storm in life that would reveal to us what we really believe and so what happened at this part of the gospels. Jesus this is the first mass miracle that Jesus had done. Up until now he is doing one on one and the disciples still don’t know the identity of Jesus – as the Christ – as the Messiah.
They know Him as a miracle worker. They know Him as a teacher. They know Him as a prophet. But they don’t know Him as Jesus the Christ – the Son of God. The anointed one – the Messiah and it is interesting to me that you can sit in church week after week and you can sit in the midst of miracles of God and what is happening through this ministry and through this church across the world is nothing short of a modern day sign and wonder and miracle. Nothing short of that….
Chris Rosebrough, “Really so the growth of Life Church Dot TV as a result of the false twisting and telling people what they want to hear – false Bible teaching and twisting of Craig Groeschel and him telling scratching itching ears. That is somehow a modern sign and miracle. Close to you know Jesus walking on the water or the feeding of the five thousand. Good night….”
Christine Caine, “But you can be in the midst of all of that and you can see the miracles of God. Hundreds of millions of YouVersions being downloaded and campuses exploding all around the place through this wonderful ministry and you can see that influence and you can be sitting in it and you can see the miracle.
You can partake of the miracle and you can know all about the miracles of God and not have yet met the God of the miracles and so Jesus is saying, ‘It is not enough that you just know about my works and my acts. You have got to know Me and I want to know if you know Me.’ So He sends them into a storm….”
Chris Rosebrough, “You know by the way in The Gospel of John I mean with the calling of the apostle Andrew. The disciple Andrew he was a disciple before he was an apostle. Already then the disciples knew then Jesus was the Messiah. You know so this point of hers doesn’t make any sense when you take a look at all of the gospels together….”
Christine Caine, “So He sends them into a storm. It is the best way to find that out and He goes up to a mountain to pray and you think why well because now His ministry is about to blow up. From this point on in the text Jesus ministry through the gospels is going to blow up. Because the ingredients of the miracle are ten thousand people and they are going to go home to their villages and tell everybody about what He just did….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Uh no again actually no she hasn’t done her homework. Okay now I told you that John 6 is the only cross reference where we learn about the little boy. Okay so in John 6 we have John’s account here of this same miracle on the same day. Okay and so let me consider and let me continue reading. I will read John 6 and I will start at v11.
John 6 v 11-14 (ESV – English Standard Version)
11 Jesus then took the loaves, and when he had given thanks, he distributed them to those who were seated. So also the fish, as much as they wanted. 12 And when they had eaten their fill, he told his disciples, “Gather up the leftover fragments, that nothing may be lost.” 13 So they gathered them up and filled twelve baskets with fragments from the five barley loaves left by those who had eaten. 14 When the people saw the sign that he had done, they said, “This is indeed the Prophet who is to come into the world!”
So Christine Caine says, ‘Oh Jesus ministry blows up from here…’ as if it goes into megachurch mode. No it doesn’t. Let me continue reading….
John 6 v 15-21 (ESV – English Standard Version)
15 Perceiving then that they were about to come and take him by force to make him king, Jesus withdrew again to the mountain by himself. 16 When evening came, his disciples went down to the sea, 17 got into a boat, and started across the sea to Capernaum. It was now dark, and Jesus had not yet come to them. 18 The sea became rough because a strong wind was blowing. 19 When they had rowed about three or four miles, they saw Jesus walking on the sea and coming near the boat, and they were frightened. 20 But he said to them, “It is I; do not be afraid.” 21 Then they were glad to take him into the boat, and immediately the boat was at the land to which they were going.
Okay so clearly we are dealing with the same events. Right well let’s continue reading and find out if Jesus ministry just blows up like the way Christine Caine said right.
John 6 v 22-41 (ESV – English Standard Version)
22 On the next day the crowd that remained on the other side of the sea saw that there had been only one boat there, and that Jesus had not entered the boat with his disciples, but that his disciples had gone away alone. 23 Other boats from Tiberias came near the place where they had eaten the bread after the Lord had given thanks. 24 So when the crowd saw that Jesus was not there, nor his disciples, they themselves got into the boats and went to Capernaum, seeking Jesus.
25 When they found him on the other side of the sea, they said to him, “Rabbi, when did you come here?” 26 Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you are seeking me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate your fill of the loaves. 27 Do not work for the food that perishes, but for the food that endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you. For on him God the Father has set his seal.” 28 Then they said to him, “What must we do, to be doing the works of God?”29 Jesus answered them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in him whom he has sent.” 30 So they said to him, “Then what sign do you do, that we may see and believe you? What work do you perform? 31 Our fathers ate the manna in the wilderness; as it is written, ‘He gave them bread from heaven to eat.’” 32 Jesus then said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, it was not Moses who gave you the bread from heaven, but my Father gives you the true bread from heaven. 33 For the bread of God is he who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.” 34 They said to him, “Sir, give us this bread always.”
35 Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; whoever comes to me shall not hunger, and whoever believes in me shall never thirst. 36 But I said to you that you have seen me and yet do not believe.37 All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out. 38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do my own will but the will of him who sent me. 39 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. 40 For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day. 41 So the Jews grumbled about him, because he said, “I am the bread that came down from heaven.”
Okay they are upset because they want more of…they want Jesus to be the bread king. To give them bread always right and so Jesus says, ‘Hey I am the bread of life…’ and they are like, ‘come on Jesus…’
John 6 v 42 (ESV – English Standard Version)
42 They said, “Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How does he now say, ‘I have come down from heaven’?”
So now they don’t even believe in Him even after
He fed them yet the day yesterday right.
John 6 v 43-70 (ESV – English Standard Version)
43 Jesus answered them, “Do not grumble among yourselves. 44 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day. 45 It is written in the Prophets, ‘And they will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father comes to me— 46 not that anyone has seen the Father except he who is from God; he has seen the Father. 47 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes has eternal life. 48 I am the bread of life. 49 Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and they died. 50 This is the bread that comes down from heaven, so that one may eat of it and not die. 51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever. And the bread that I will give for the life of the world is my flesh.”
52 The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, “How can this man give us his flesh to eat?”53 So Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. 54 Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day. 55 For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink.56 Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him. 57 As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so whoever feeds on me, he also will live because of me.58 This is the bread that came down from heaven, not like the bread the fathers ate, and died. Whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.” 59 Jesus said these things in the synagogue, as he taught at Capernaum.
60 When many of his disciples heard it, they said, “This is a hard saying; who can listen to it?” 61 But Jesus, knowing in himself that his disciples were grumbling about this, said to them, “Do you take offense at this? 62 Then what if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before? 63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh is no help at all. The words that I have spoken to you are spirit and life. 64 But there are some of you who do not believe.” (For Jesus knew from the beginning who those were who did not believe, and who it was who would betray him.) 65 And he said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.” 66 After this many of his disciples turned back and no longer walked with him.
So immediately after the feeding of the five thousand you have this discourse where Jesus gives them a tough saying. Unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood, you have no life in you right and you know….
John 6 v 65 (ESV – English Standard Version)
65 And he said, “This is why I told you that no
one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.”
No can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him and you know what happens to his disciples? They leave.
John 6 v 66-70 (ESV – English Standard Version)
66 After this many of his disciples turned back and no longer walked with him.
67 So Jesus said to the Twelve, “Do you want to go away as well?” 68 Simon Peter answered him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life. 69 and we have believed, and have come to know, that you are the Holy One of God.” 70 Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you, the Twelve? And yet one of you is a devil.”
So Christine Caine doesn’t know her Bible. She is preaching. She shouldn’t be and she is teaching. She shouldn’t be. But she is teaching that Jesus ministry takes off kind of like you know like megachurch style like Hillsong after the feeding of the five thousand and that is a flat out historical falsehood. That is not what happens after the feeding of the five thousand. After the feeding of the five thousand Jesus preaches some tough doctrine and it results in Jesus church shrinking to the size of twelve. Yeah how big was Jesus church on the day when He was crucified. How many people were there – rooting for Him, telling Pontus Pilate not to crucify Jesus? Uh huh we continue….
Christine Caine, “So He sends them into a storm. It is the best way to find that out and He goes up to a mountain to pray and you think why well because now His ministry is about to blow up. From this point on in the text Jesus ministry through the gospels is going to blow up. Because the ingredients of the miracle are ten thousand people and they are going to go home to their villages and tell everybody about what He just did and if your ministry is about to blow up to that extent.
You better get on your face on a mountain before God and start praying. So He is praying and The Bible says now it is about the fourth watch of the night which takes to us to about three o’ clock in the morning. So at three o’ clock in the morning He is praying. Then He looks out and the disciples. The scripture says that the storm started straining at the oars which means they are freaking out massively.
So they are freaking out. It is dark. They are wondering where Jesus is. I don’t know if you have ever been like that. You could have been in an awesome church meeting and then just hours later you are wondering why has God forsaken me? Why am I out in this storm? Why am I here? Now it is Wednesday and Sunday pastor Craig said everything was going to be awesome and now it is Wednesday and look at my marriage and look at my finances and look at my health and look at my children and I am in this storm and you are wondering where God is and if I don’t if anyone else besides me has ever been there.
Where are you God? Where are you? It seems so dark and it seems so dangerous and the interesting thing is Jesus could see them. He could see. He knows where you are right at this moment, wherever you are listening to this. He knows exactly what is going on and this is the great thing. It is a perk of being God. He can be with you right in the middle of that storm while He is coming to you to deliver you from the storm.
That is what happens when you are God and so what they didn’t realise was that He had asked them to take the broken pieces with them into the boat and essentially what he was….did you ever wonder why broken pieces – why scraps – why fragments? Why couldn’t He do the miracle again on the other side? Why fish heads? Why fish bones? Why bread crumbs? Because this was what Jesus was essentially saying to them, “I want each of you to take evidence of this miracle today into the storm of tomorrow.” Because I want you to remember that the same God that just….
Chris Rosebrough, “What Jesus nowhere says that, you just gave Jesus words and stuck them in His mouth that He never once spoke. This is nonsense….”
Christine Caine, “This was what Jesus was essentially saying to them, “I want each of you to take evidence of this miracle today into the storm of tomorrow. Because I want you to remember that the same God that just did that miracle for you on the mountain – is the same God that is going to be with you in this boat. It is the same God that is going to take you to the other side.
You were never gifted. You were never talented. You were never smart enough to do this in your own strength anyway. You have actually never had anything more than five loaves and two fishes and the same God that did the miracle for you back then is the same God that will do the miracle for you in the middle of the storm. It doesn’t matter what is happening politically.
It doesn’t matter what is happening socially. It doesn’t matter what is happening economically. It doesn’t matter. What happens with us is the minute we come out of a miracle and we see a negative news report and we see something negative is happening in Wall Street or something negative is happening politically or we look at all the disasters happening around us. We begin to panic as if somehow God fell off the throne and God is saying, ‘When did ever think you had enough money in the first place? When did you ever think you had enough gifts in the first place?’ It always was God. It always will be God. It always was Christ alone. It always will be Christ alone. It doesn’t matter….
You know a lot of us we get good with now. We get confident with where we are now and we forget about back then and when the enemy comes to torment me. I don’t start telling him about oh I run this global anti human trafficking organisation now. I speak around the world now. Because this can all change. Governments can change. Policies and A21 can shut down.
People can stop inviting me. Now I don’t talk to him about now. That is not where my confidence is….I go back to then. That girl who was in hospital, unnamed and unwanted. The same God that kept me alive then is the same God that is with me now. That kid that was abused all those years. The same God that somehow protected me in the midst of all that. He was with me then. He is with me now….”
Chris Rosebrough, “Yeah the I want to point this all out. This is autobiography masquerading as Christian theology. This is not Christian theology. This is just her giving autobiography….”
Christine Caine, “The same kid that used to speak to twenty kids in the backside and nowhere in Australia. The same God that plucked me out of anonymity and obscurity then is the same God that is with me now. It always was Jesus. It always will be Jesus. Whatever is before me. It always was him and he is doing what he has always done. He is continuing to build his church.
He said, ‘I will be build my church and the gates of hell shall not prevail – against the church of the living God.’ Whatever happens economically, politically, morally, socially, environmentally. Jesus doing what he has always done. He is building his church and the gates of hell shall not prevail against the church of the living God ever. He is doing what he has always done.
And so he goes out to the disciples and they are freaking out and this is what happens when you get your eyes off your fragments off your broken pieces and you get your eyes on the wind and the waves. What happens is Jesus can come out to you. The same Jesus….”
Chris Rosebrough, “This is what happens when you get your eyes off your broken fragments and pieces from your last miracle. I seem to remember that one of the gospel writers I think it is Matthew gives us a little bit more to the story and tells us about Peter walking on the water at this point and his eyes were never on the broken fragments and the fish heads and the basket and the boat.
They were on Jesus and when they were off Jesus, he ended up sinking. Notice the emphasis is always taken away from Jesus. Our focus is always taken away from Christ in the way these people mangle God’s word. They make it about themselves. They make it about something they have done and now it is no longer keeping your eyes on Jesus. It is keeping your eyes on the broken fragment pieces and the fish heads and the baskets from the leftovers. Unbelievable….”
Christine Caine, “The same Jesus that was on the mountain with you doing miracles or the day before and you don’t even recognize him. Because Jesus uses the storms of life to reveal a different aspect of himself to us. They knew the Jesus that did the fish and loaves. They didn’t know the Jesus that walked on water. I don’t know what miracle you might need right now. But Jesus is coming in a new form and in a new way to do a new thing in your life.”
Chris Rosebrough, “Yeah this text doesn’t teach any of that. You are just.
This is all just smoke and mirrors….”
Christine Caine, “Don’t box Him back into what he used to do. In the way that He used to do it. Allow room for him to come in a different way to deliver you from this storm. You don’t need the Jesus that multiplies the fish and loaves when you are in a storm in the middle of an ocean….”
Chris Rosebrough, “What are you talking about? That is the same Jesus….”
Christine Caine, “You need a Jesus that walks on water. Don’t think that the very God that is coming to deliver you is the God that is coming to destroy you. He is actually coming to you in a different form. He gets in the boat and the disciples look at him and The Bible says he is disappointed not because they were scared in the storm. But because they had not understood the miracle of the loaves and fishes.
I wonder friend if you are someone that has been sitting in church for or today is your first day or perhaps weeks, months, years and you have known the God of you have known the miracles of God. You have seen signs and wonders and you have watched God do amazing things in your midst. Let’s never be a church that just knows the miracles of God. Let’s be a church that is intimately acquainted with the God of the miracles in Jesus name.”
Chris Rosebrough, “Oh man wow what a mess. Unbelievable – see that tells you about the level of biblical expertees on the part of the so called pastors of Hillsong. That should tell you something. She is a product of Brian Houston’s teaching and preaching and what she preaches is absolutely reprehensible and her mangling of scripture.
She learned that from somebody. She learned it from Brian Houston and she is not somebody who should be listened to as if she has a word to bring to us from God. Because she doesn’t. She twists God’s word and preaches herself and that is part and parcel of the major problem of you know what passes for preaching from churches like Hillsong and Life Church Dot TV and others. Pray that Christ brings His church to repentance for this nonsense.
Alright we are at the end of another edition of Fighting for the Faith. If you would like to email me regarding anything you have heard on this edition or any previous editions of Fighting for the Faith. You can do so my email address is email@example.com or you can subscribe on Facebook http://www.facebook.com or you can follow me on Twitter. My name there is @piratechristian. Until tomorrow may God richly bless you in the grace and mercy won by Jesus Christ and His vicarious death on the cross for all of your sins amen.
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